[ZS] Improving Remantling



  • In the current state of the gameplay mechanic, I legitimately feel I could make remantling much more interesting then it presently is and more prevalent beyond a recycling mechanic, which it presently falls into the niche of.

    As of now you have these values for the different qualities of weapons:

    • Sturdy: +9% damage - Requires 2 normal weapons total
    • Honed: +17% damage - Requires 4 normal weapons total
    • Perfected: +24% damage - Requires 8 normal weapons total

    You can probably project that beyond Sturdy weapons people, in my experience and understanding, never really make them because the return from these weapons is not there. That probably signifies that Sturdy weapons are probably in a good spot for the damage bonus they provide but Honed and Perfected weapons need to change. The change made so that weapons above Tier 2 can be used same quality weapons of the same tier helps in this case (You can remantle a Glock and a Magnum to get a Sturdy type of one of those), but it doesn’t really fix the problem.They simply require too many resources in total and don’t impart enough of a significant bonus.

    I’ve got a few ideas how I might go about changing this, but I’m up for suggestions. Note that these ideas might not even be mutually exclusive with each other.

    • Introduce a second changing stat for weapons that is unique to each weapon, that could only occur at Honed or higher, sort of like modifying your weapons in System Shock 2. - http://shodan.wikia.com/wiki/Modify. This wouldn’t be hard to implement if it was just statistical changes. For example a Honed Magnum reloads a bit faster in addition to getting more damage.
    • Make the quality bonuses on Honed and Perfected MUCH higher. Actually match the resources required to assemble a weapon of this type. The main issue of this is the concern that it would potentially make higher tier weapons too irrelevant if done to too high an extent. I wouldn’t mind seeing more remantled weapons to increase the variety in the later stages of the game, but careful consideration needs to be made if this change is taken into account.
    • Reduce the amount of weapons required in total for Honed and Perfected. This would also involve changing the recipes for them in the remantler which would potentially make it less obvious on how to craft them. There is however, a message stating what you need for each craft which mitigates this problem. Say for example Honed would require 3 total instead: Sturdy + Normal weapon, and perhaps Perfected being 5 total: Honed + Sturdy. This is sort of the boring option but it is also relatively safe in fixing the problem, there’s just the risk of confusion with potentially more complex recipes.
    • Introduce more ways to upgrade INSTEAD of making a weapon Honed/Perfected, which would be increasing the damage. This is the hardest one to implement and design and the upgrade option(s) would need to be as universal as possible. It also raises the issue of how one might select such an upgrade with the Remantler, and it also could be too complex for ZS just in general. An example might be upgrade paths instead of damage that increase rate of fire.


  • I’ve always found remantling fairly boring overall. Nobody ever really does it past sturdy, and when they do it’s usually for shits and giggles on a crackler or something similar. I like all of these ideas really. If I had to pick I’d say the third option, or if you were doing multiple than introduce the third now and either add the fourth or replace it with the fourth later, to give you time to balance and design.

    If you do decide on the fourth option, then maybe a new crafting station could be created. The remantler keeps its current purpose, but a new station allows you to upgrade your weapons following a tree, unlocking abilities or simple stat changes through some mechanic other than remantling (points maybe, buy attachments and the like). You could silence weapons, give them higher headshot damage but lower bodyshot damage, you get the gist. I don’t know how well this fits into a 6-wave setup, but something similar to it worked really well on an 8-wave server.

    My idea, doesn’t act like any of the ones you suggested:

    I would suggest maybe adding a special ability to every weapon that gets unlocked at honed, and then either another at perfected or just upgrade the existing. EX: Stubber has a high chance to instantly knock a zombie down, crackler has a chance for a shot to not consume ammo, crossbow bolts can bounce off of walls once, pulse shots have a low chance to completely stun a zombie for 1-2 secs, battleaxe/waraxe have a chance to do 3x headshot damage (cleave the head), you get the gist.



  • I definitely feel like remantling could be better, in the sense that say, for a glock, it costs over 120 points worth of glocks to get a 7 damage increase.

    Adding a second stat that gets changed per weapon (a la SS2) would probably help both the system and weapons that aren’t so viable be picked up a bit more.



  • Introduce a second changing stat for weapons that is unique to each weapon, that could only occur at Honed or higher

    :star::star::star::star::star:



  • My idea, doesn’t act like any of the ones you suggested:

    I would suggest maybe adding a special ability to every weapon that gets unlocked at honed

    Probably not going to happen since that one in particular itself is too much work.

    Edit: The stat change is fine, though.



  • I agree on the “no one seems to go past sturdy except with starting weapons thing”. I usually get a sturdy Splinter and then wait to get a tier 4-5 instead of remantling it further because I don’t feel that a 17% increase in damage is worth 120 points.



  • I am also probably going to make it so remantling requires a value of recycled guns instead of a specific gun. So higher tier and higher quality weapons are worth more of this value, and upgrading a higher tier or higher quality weapons requires more. This should provide more freedom with recycling weapons you’re not using. Putting your weapon inside the remantler will tell you what you need like it does now, but it will tell you the value. Tell me what you think of this.



  • @Raox

    Sounds good. Gives a use for all those T1s laying around other than just going for perfected ones for no reason.



  • After-the-fact post of sorts: I really like how it was handled in the official update. Now if only people would actually read patch notes so they would know to get remantlers now.



  • now it’s much easier to make a perfected plank just collect dropped guns/melee



  • Would it be possible to allow us to use our remaining scrap for a clip of ammunition for the type of weapon we deposit? It just feels like we could use something like 2-4 scrap for a clip of ammo when we have maxed out the remantled weapon or are most likely not going to get a perfected version. That said though I much prefer this system compared to the old one since it no longer feels useless investing way too many points when you could just get a T5 for the same amount.



  • After-the-fact post of sorts: I really like how it was handled in the official update. Now if only people would actually read patch notes so they would know to get remantlers now.

    Thanks, glad to hear. I’m still looking at ways to expand and improve upon on it, but I’m definitely feeling it’s a much more robust system to expand on now. People from my experience have taken to it well.

    Would it be possible to allow us to use our remaining scrap for a clip of ammunition for the type of weapon we deposit?

    I’m debating this internally in my head; if I did go down that route it wouldn’t be cheaper to use scrap for this, it would at least be roughly the same cost or more expensive (since a point to scrap conversion is always going to exist). Scrap roughly is worth about 2.17 points, so we’re talking about 5-6 scrap for a particular clip. That sort of functionality of acquiring any type of ammo with the old scrap system for remantlers was lost but I can sort of bring it back in that respect.

    On a relatively important side note, the next thing I’m likely to do is move trinkets to being actually purchasable with scrap. It’s quite undeniable to say that they aren’t purchased often because they often interfere pretty much with the gameplay flow of earning points. You’re trying to compete on a single currency - that being with acquiring better weapons to provide a better DPS output for defence or simply for buying deployables for your team, such as an Aegis, compared with something that gives you a statistical and often minor benefit, so of course players aren’t going to really spend their points on this, you cannot compete the point train for acquiring an end game weapon. The solution I really feel is moving trinkets to be acquired with scrap. It makes more sense because they’re thematically similar to upgrading your weapons and providing some statistical benefit for you. The way this works out is that now you would have a choice with scrap, to either upgrade your weapons or upgrade yourself, both are statistical benefits. As mentioned above the one way conversion between points to scrap exists, so you’d still be able to buy them with points for that matter.



  • @Raox said in [ZS] Improving Remantling:

    The solution I really feel is moving trinkets to be acquired with scrap. It makes more sense because they’re thematically similar to upgrading your weapons and providing some statistical benefit for you.

    Do you mean strictly through scrap or available through both ways?

    Trinkets are a good boost for any T5 that can profit decently and I’m pretty sure everyone that’s ever gotten a t6 sees the value of the reload ones. If this is moved entirely to the remantler it basically adds an extra step for the people with high tier weapons and more importantly massively changes how important a remantler/scrap can be.

    I think the remantler is better than before, though.



  • I get you, I meant only scrap. But that IS a downside. Probably leaving point purchases as well might be the solution, I guess that’s fine, just a bit messy in terms of design/implementation, but it doesn’t actually cause any problems to leave that option.


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