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[ZS] Changes to the unpopular T5s & General T5 balance

  • I made this thread with two weapons in mind but I don’t see making another thread for the rest of the tier.

    With the boomstick and sweeper buff, the tier 5 weapons are pretty well off. Tier 5 is very important because it’s the endgame for 95% of the regulars, as T6 is too situational/luck reliant for most. That’s why I’d like to address some issues in the tier, mainly the Tiny Slug Rifle and the Helios Gluon Gun.

    Helios Gluon Gun:
    The recent buff to gluon was nice and it has purpose for poorly made barricades, barricades at the bottom of ladders and for high burst damage. Gluon is not useless as it is but it leaves a lot to be desired. It’s niche is not very common; Impaler is superior for large hordes, sweeper is superior for small groups and scar is arguably better in the middle. I’ve talked to people on the server about their ideas for what could become of the gluon and the old idea of a higher priced/tier 6 gluon was tossed around. The old Gluon was too cheap for the power it had but it would fit in fine even with the heat mechanic in tier 6 if done properly. However, I understand the aversion to adding it to tier 6 when multiple pulse weapons will be the only ones there. (potential solution to this after I talk about tiny slug)

    Tiny Slug:
    This weapon isn’t really bought seriously by anyone. There’s few chances to take advantage of it’s long range by the time you can get it and it feels plain weak compared to the rest of the tier. Problem is, I don’t know what to do with it. Snipers are my least used weapon class and someone else will need to chime in for this weapon. Tiny slug can be fun to use but it serves almost no role for most games.

    Separate Things:

    -Moving the reaper up to tier 5
    I heard this was in the works. Something to note for this is that it would be hard to implement without being essentially an smg-ammo scar clone without a gimmick for the weapon, although I hear this is planned as well. Reaper hasn’t been a real choice in years and the tier 3 smgs now have two distinct options: Burst (Silencer) and Sustain (Shredder) leaving it little room where it is.

    -A new tier 6 weapon, not the gluon, to fulfill the high dps non aoe role gluon had
    If the idea of pushing gluon to 250/300 points in t6 isn’t something people want to see, perhaps the m249 from cs:s can find a place now. It’s extremely rare for two people to get spinfusors in one game and spinfusor is already difficult to work around for the zombies due to it negating most of the smaller classes by itself. A high dps assaultrifle esque weapon wouldn’t introduce human sided problems I think and would present a different high tier option for situations where a spinfusor wouldn’t work as well, such as a map with many windows. I understand the sentiment against adding the m249 but it is probably a better option than moving gluon up.


    -Gluon feels too niche.
    -Tiny Slug feels too niche.
    -Reaper UMP, if moved to T5 shouldn’t be a Scar clone.
    -M249 Can fulfill the old gluon’s role, potentially.

  • What we have in store for the Reaper will make it a little more situational compared to the SCAR but will give an incentive to get the quickdraw skill. If testing shows it works like we imagined it we might see new strategies in the future.

  • Tiny slug should just get a bigger headshot modifier; the charm of snipers was always the high burst damage on headshots. Stubber’s 110 damage on headshot for example is basically giving the finger to fresh dead if you can aim.

    Forgot the Tiny Slug’s passive, oops

    It’s also a problem with snipers in general, their niche is having a lot of sightlines and hallway cades but more often than not a hallway cade is a luxury rarely found and long sightlines are typically only found outside the cade.

  • Weapon balance arguably a very very critical point in ZS, if not the most important balancing point to consider for humans since it is more often than not the preferred role. That’s why getting the weapon balance fun and right is vital and arguably more important than some bugfixes since if it is in a bad position, can translate to poor repeated gameplay.

    Tiny slug should just get a bigger headshot modifier; the charm of snipers was always the high burst damage on headshots.

    It already instantly kills anything that isn’t a boss on a headshot. That’s pretty much the best headshot multiplier you can give it. I don’t really know how to change the Tiny Slug really. It can be insanely potent in the right situation (generally for getting a chain of 425 damage headshots on Poison Zombies) and can yield massive amounts of points, but it is like most rifles, a hallway/open map oriented weapon. Not much that can be done here I think.


    I probably do want to end up leaving it in Tier 5. I think it’s very close or even at where it should be now, but might need one or two very tiny buffs to make it more usable. It’s not wholly terrible anymore. I’d be more in favour of adding something like an M249 really. I actually don’t really understand the feelings towards adding it to Tier 6 because I mean it does feature as an elusive tier that should feature high powered weapons for the insane price you’re paying. Don’t even think it needs recoil or anything like that, it’s not going to have an infinite clip size like the Gluon did. Could have a tiny wind up of rate of fire or something, who knows.

  • @Raox said in [ZS] Changes to the unpopular T5s & General T5 balance:

    don’t really know how to change the Tiny Slug really

    That’s fine. I was stumped on options for it because it’s hard to change it but it will always have it’s niche.


    I’m fine with the t5 gluon as long as it doesn’t feel like a less profitable scar, DPS wise. The ability to shoot anywhere on a zombie’s body means it won’t ever really be completely useless.

  • I really like the idea of have an M249 SWEP in the game. However, I would like to note that it would probably be quite the ammo hog and as such, the little ammo received from the Resupply wouldn’t be enough to power it., assuming it uses rifle ammo. So, assuming it uses rifle ammo I’ve come up with 2 solutions to that problem:

    A ) Give the M249 its own class of amuntion.
    B ) Have the M249 fire 3 projectiles instead of 1.

    I’m in favor of B for multiple reasons, but I’m too scatter brained to write them down.

  • wtf

    the little ammo received from the Resupply wouldn’t be enough to power it.

    How on earth do you even know that? What are you even talking about. Can just buy ammo lol you’d be able to sustain it most likely from an Arsenal since it would be Tier 5+. Like most high tier weapons can be sustained unless you’re braindead and unload into walls.