[ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment



  • I think 3 options and general opinions have been mainly discussed about the Deagle right now.

    1. Nerf it by raw statistics, of which in this case the accuracy would be the major problem but keep it in Tier 2.
    2. Move the Deagle to Tier 3 as discussed in this thread. Reasoning is explained more in detail there: https://forum.noxiousnet.com/topic/14624/zs-tier-3-pistol-and-tier-5-smg
    3. Don’t change it at all. It’s fine as it is.

    I’m personally slightly more of the opinion of changing it to a Tier 3 weapon to reduce the pistol bloat in Tier 2. What do you think the course of action should be if any.



  • I honestly think it’s fine. Accuracy is where it should be and the 47 damage works fine. I consider it to be on par with the glock, but I just like single shot weapons better.



  • I prefer using the glock as I manage to get more points with that over the deagle most of the time so I’d say it’s fine as it is.



  • It makes the magnum completely obsolete and why a handcannon like a deagle isn’t higher tier is beyond me.



  • Revert the glock, nerf the deagle, there needs to be a meta in Tier 2 a reliable weapon more so a go to weapon, the deagle has been that “go to” weapon and pushing it up a tier would make it harder for players to obtain it, considering no one purchases a T3 as often as it extends the time to which someone can get a T5-T6.

    If the deagle is nerfed then what is the next “go to weapon” a splinter won’t help on big maps and the crossbow pistol is only good in some situations, The Glock’s accuracy is pretty shitty, The magnum is absolute garbage , Hurricane SMG chomps ammo, Amigo is a joke.

    Deagle is fine in my opinion because you can use it and get a good weapon on wave 4/5/6 which is really the point of it. to use a weapon and get a T5 late game, Unless you want T5s to come out during Wave 5 and 6…



  • the deagle has been that “go to” weapon and pushing it up a tier would make it harder for players to obtain it

    Redact your sentiment.

    pushing it up a tier would make it harder for players to obtain it, considering no one purchases a T3 as often as it extends the time to which someone can get a T5-T6.

    This might actually end up being a nerf that does in fact, make the gamemode, believe it or not, harder, and that’s not a bad thing. I’ve heard the opinion of the deagle being a problem weapon in terms of the balance of the gamemode.

    If the deagle is nerfed then what is the next “go to weapon” a splinter won’t help on big maps and the crossbow pistol is only good in some situations, The Glock’s accuracy is pretty shitty, The magnum is absolute garbage , Hurricane SMG chomps ammo, Amigo is a joke.

    You’ve made 2 errors with this, if we’re going by your objection to nerfing standard.

    1. You infer that a nerf would make it unusable, which would be the typical overreaction to nerfs, which would make the assumption that whoever controls the values is already too incompetent to make the “right” change.
    2. Shouldn’t guns be situational in the first place? What’s the point of having other guns if people are only going to use the one? “It’s preference” is a distorted opinion.

    I’m not asserting about what should be done to the deagle here, but your argument is rather moot and ineffective for making this case.

    Deagle is fine in my opinion because you can use it and get a good weapon on wave 4/5/6 which is really the point of it.

    Is it? Why can’t you do that with other weapons? Are you sure?



  • Honestly, I like having the Deagle in Tier 2 as the more long range option. As much as I like the Magnum, it feels too situational to me and really depends on the map you’re on for it to be good. A nerf to it’s baseline stats so it isn’t the go-to weapon in any situation including in close range over the Glock (Which doesn’t make sense) would be nice.
    It’s more of a general issue, but T3-T4s are barely used, since people usually just do T2 -> T5 most of the time, and the Deagle is currently the main offender there.

    The gamemode becoming harder would be nice actually; it feels too easy to win right now if you get a few people who spawn camp the zombies well and a decent cader in the back while that happens.



  • Why did this gun get an accuracy buff in the 1st place?



  • @Raox said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:

    the deagle has been that “go to” weapon and pushing it up a tier would make it harder for players to obtain it

    Redact your sentiment.

    pushing it up a tier would make it harder for players to obtain it, considering no one purchases a T3 as often as it extends the time to which someone can get a T5-T6.

    This might actually end up being a nerf that does in fact, make the gamemode, believe it or not, harder, and that’s not a bad thing. I’ve heard the opinion of the deagle being a problem weapon in terms of the balance of the gamemode.

    If the deagle is nerfed then what is the next “go to weapon” a splinter won’t help on big maps and the crossbow pistol is only good in some situations, The Glock’s accuracy is pretty shitty, The magnum is absolute garbage , Hurricane SMG chomps ammo, Amigo is a joke.

    You’ve made 2 errors with this, if we’re going by your objection to nerfing standard.

    1. You infer that a nerf would make it unusable, which would be the typical overreaction to nerfs, which would make the assumption that whoever controls the values is already too incompetent to make the “right” change.
    2. Shouldn’t guns be situational in the first place? What’s the point of having other guns if people are only going to use the one? “It’s preference” is a distorted opinion.

    I’m not asserting about what should be done to the deagle here, but your argument is rather moot and ineffective for making this case.

    Deagle is fine in my opinion because you can use it and get a good weapon on wave 4/5/6 which is really the point of it.

    Is it? Why can’t you do that with other weapons? Are you sure?

    What I’m trying to put out is that if the deagle is nerfed than most of the players will look for another “meta” weapon that being probably the glock or splinter, The other weapons such as the amigo, spray and hurricane chew ammo like a gas guzzler, unless another player provides you ammo it’s going to be a long game till you get a T5 because you would have to change your entire setup i.e Blaster + Crackler ammo > Amigo etc… not to mention the accuracy of these weapons are horrendous like the Sprayer and Hurricane, they have about the same accuracy as the Tosser which is by far the worst weapon next to the Stubber. Fair enough these weapons are automatic and they are to burn ammo but there is no efficiency with them it’s like using a gluon your ammo will get chewed and chances are at the end of the day unless you get fed your gonna end up buying ammo for a T2…

    Situational weapons are fine i.e The Inquisitor, it’s really based on preferences, however, in situations where there is always 1 weapon that would suit every battlefield there always needs to be 1, for example, Battlefield 3 had the M16A3, the most common weapon because of it’s simplicity and efficiency on the field.

    Makin it to a T5 on wave 4 is rather easy. You can do it with other weapons but nothing like the deagle, if anything I’d say make it 35 points but pushing it up a tier would render it useless since T3 purchases are rather pointless, All the other weapons can make it but with significant ammo provided i.e if a guy dies with 500 smg or 350 smg ammo then T3 would be useful, Ever since Ender was nerfed the T3s are completely useless. Otherwise with any other weapon than the Deagle and Splinter it’s going to take a while to achieve a T5 i.e Wave 5/6 Intermission. The Splinter is really good but this isn’t some vanilla server, running outside past Wave 3 is asking for a death sentence with a splinter, even qwert can stay out that long before getting completely swarmed and we don’t have enough crackler ammo to reach a deagle unless it’s complete retard hour and your the only DPS player.

    Finally, the gamemode is based on teamwork if the collective works together in winning with good supports, good cades and good shooters than why shouldn’t the human team win? We’ve all seen double spinfusors, double gluon and adonis’s all die because of the lack of teamwork, wheter it be no healers and everyone dies due to lack of health, shit caders or a lack of communication we can still die I believe that the server is fine with the balance of the weapons. You’re representing the deagle as an effective weapon that ANYone can use however, there are usually point gaps inbetween good players and people that decided to pick up the deagle.



  • If people try to find a new meta weapon if the deagle gets nerfed then good at least we won’t have to deal with a retard crutch.



  • wow u tried ok then

    First up your overall theme that you’re attacking with this basically ends up seemingly to coalign with an overarching issue that I’ve previously brought up here: https://forum.noxiousnet.com/topic/14748/is-it-acceptable-if-a-weapon-isn-t-purchased-frequently. You’re identifying that yeah, a lot of weapons aren’t purchased frequently for whatever reason. However that’s actually contrary to the topic and if anything should be brought up there. The way I’m actually treating the deagle here, is I have brought up the topic of considering it an emergency balance issue that would in fact be not considering these issues too strongly at the present time, and more so for the reasons that the deagle is potentially too strong in the absolute strength rather looking at it relatively and, by extension affecting the gamemode negatively besides the current balance state of weapons. Fair enough, you may be of the opinion that isn’t the case.

    Situational weapons are fine i.e The Inquisitor, it’s really based on preferences, however, in situations where there is always 1 weapon that would suit every battlefield there always needs to be 1, for example, Battlefield 3 had the M16A3, the most common weapon because of it’s simplicity and efficiency on the field.

    If a weapon is to be a jack of all trades as you call it then it shouldn’t be too effective at everything and I don’t feel the Desert Eagle honestly, within my opinion fits that bill. It has accuracy, a good base damage per second, and it is further bolstered by extension of getting headshots and actually landing these shots. It’s one of the most efficient pistols from accuracy and base damage, so it grants safety, increasing the popularity of choice. A quick reload grants it increased sustained DPS, also. It’s very good at what it does and from these descriptors it’s probably beyond a generic jack of all trades.

    Additionally I wouldn’t consider the fact that just because something does not assure a win does not mean that it isn’t still broken at all. I personally believe that the Deagle IS a weapon that is too easy to use for little risk. The risk of a jack of all trades weapon is supposed to be the fact that it ends up not specialising in particular area which causes it to lack when other weapons are their strengths, and I don’t think this is generally the case.



  • @Gestapo said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:

    @Raox said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:
    Finally, the gamemode is based on teamwork if the collective works together in winning with good supports, good cades and good shooters than why shouldn’t the human team win? We’ve all seen double spinfusors, double gluon and adonis’s all die because of the lack of teamwork, wheter it be no healers and everyone dies due to lack of health, shit caders or a lack of communication we can still die I believe that the server is fine with the balance of the weapons. You’re representing the deagle as an effective weapon that ANYone can use however, there are usually point gaps inbetween good players and people that decided to pick up the deagle.

    I’m not saying humans shouldn’t win if the team is well balanced and coordinated. The problem right now is that the Deagle makes spawn camping much more efficient than it should be, and that all you need is a few good shooters to basically make spawn unbreachable for zombies until wave 4-5 on a ton of maps, leading to a easy win as humans fall back to the cade with Gluons.



  • @Raox said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:

    wow u tried ok then

    First up your overall theme that you’re attacking with this basically ends up seemingly to coalign with an overarching issue that I’ve previously brought up here: https://forum.noxiousnet.com/topic/14748/is-it-acceptable-if-a-weapon-isn-t-purchased-frequently. You’re identifying that yeah, a lot of weapons aren’t purchased frequently for whatever reason. However that’s actually contrary to the topic and if anything should be brought up there. The way I’m actually treating the deagle here, is I have brought up the topic of considering it an emergency balance issue that would in fact be not considering these issues too strongly at the present time, and more so for the reasons that the deagle is potentially too strong in the absolute strength rather looking at it relatively and, by extension affecting the gamemode negatively besides the current balance state of weapons. Fair enough, you may be of the opinion that isn’t the case.

    Situational weapons are fine i.e The Inquisitor, it’s really based on preferences, however, in situations where there is always 1 weapon that would suit every battlefield there always needs to be 1, for example, Battlefield 3 had the M16A3, the most common weapon because of it’s simplicity and efficiency on the field.

    If a weapon is to be a jack of all trades as you call it then it shouldn’t be too effective at everything and I don’t feel the Desert Eagle honestly, within my opinion fits that bill. It has accuracy, a good base damage per second, and it is further bolstered by extension of getting headshots and actually landing these shots. It’s one of the most efficient pistols from accuracy and base damage, so it grants safety, increasing the popularity of choice. A quick reload grants it increased sustained DPS, also. It’s very good at what it does and from these descriptors it’s probably beyond a generic jack of all trades.

    Additionally I wouldn’t consider the fact that just because something does not assure a win does not mean that it isn’t still broken at all. I personally believe that the Deagle IS a weapon that is too easy to use for little risk. The risk of a jack of all trades weapon is supposed to be the fact that it ends up not specialising in particular area which causes it to lack when other weapons are their strengths, and I don’t think this is generally the case.

    I believe the Deagle is a fair jack of all trades because now due to the new edition of a T2 crossbow, you have situations where the crossbow is VERY powerful during Objs or maps where zombies are in a long hall or a tunnel or tight chokepoint and as such you can usually pass by anyone with a deagle. Or when it’s a house map where the glock’s slightly higher damage and the splinter can surpass really most players with a deagle. I will agree with you on one thing the distance on which it can hit a target is a bit overboard however, I really do not want to see the Deagle back at it’s normal status as we all know how completely trash that was, a slight decrease in accuracy at long range is fine imo, it still should be a good excel at mid-range as the glock and splinter handle the closer ranges.



  • noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_19/log045.txt
    507 21:45:16 2016 <STEAM_0:1:21756969> Kolmio: deagle sure is op
    518 <STEAM_0:1:21756969> Kolmio: ive never liked deagle and suddenly i get 50 points with it in like a mi
    536 21:47:18 2016 <STEAM_0:1:21756969> Kolmio: deagle should be nerfed tbh

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_09_17/log027.txt
    688 : i know there nerfing gloun but are they nerfing deagle
    797 d Of Hooker’ [Team Say | The Undead]: i hate deagles
    883 > Sexy Shaper Overlord Of Hooker’: i hate deagles
    916 0:44220990> insanitybomb: I see why people use deagle now
    926 erlord Of Hooker’: i hope jet nerfs or makes deagle t3
    933 5 2016 <STEAM_0:0:37788648> ATRanko: how is deagle t3 worth
    940 per Overlord Of Hooker’: if ten people get a deagle its ALOT of damage
    996 12:10:43 2016 <STEAM_0:0:37788648> ATRanko: Deagle just need a slight fire rate nerf

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_07/log036.txt
    513 016 <STEAM_0:1:61975748> Gestapo: DO U HAVE DEAGLE?
    646 6 <STEAM_0:1:8610576> Serket: holy fuck the deagle is op as fuck

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_09_21/log033.txt
    301 8610576> Serket: what’s better, waraxe or deagle?
    304 016 <STEAM_0:0:8152714> God-Emperor Takara: deagle

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_07/log025.txt
    255 :52:28 2016 <STEAM_0:0:89070893> james: new deagle is easy lol
    262 2016 <STEAM_0:1:32700365> Moist Nugget: New deagle is op af

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_07/log028.txt
    373 0:1:59929183> Monkeycena: lol sniping with the deagle

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_19/log007.txt
    302 _0:1:160903683> Mavain [Team Say | Survivors]: deagle is so accurate wtf

    noxiousnet.com/logs/localhost_27015/2016_08_26/log039.txt
    650 [email protected]: the problem is deagle is insanely powerful
    655 1275212> Sexy Shaper Overlord Of Hooker’: deagle is fucking strong for what it is
    656 22 2016 <STEAM_0:1:10581409> Alaska: remove deagle
    664 <STEAM_0:0:48943903> Big Daddy Cool: remove deagle
    671 ;STEAM_0:1:117771723> Black ★ Rock Shooter: if deagle was removed glock will be loved again
    677 16 <STEAM_0:1:3456199> anx10us: dont remove deagle, make it a t3 weapon
    717 TEAM_0:1:46064568> Noumenon: /callvote (Is the Deagle overpowered) [1] No [2] No
    751 M_0:1:45001338> PurpleOwl: give every zombie a deagle
    783 EAM_0:0:32163864> Scott: well for instance the deagle shouldnt be a sniper
    788 [email protected]: deagle has better accuracy than most rifles



  • I knew this would be polarizing but Jesus, this became TL;DR the thread. If this does get boosted up to tier 3, what kind of damage would it do and what would it cost? 60 points and 59 damage? I’d prefer the accuracy to not improve, but a minor nerf to its original value wouldn’t hurt it too much.



  • I think it would be fine if deagle had an accuracy between the old and new values.

    If it’s moved to t3, any damage higher than 55 or so means two shots to the head to kill a normal zombie, which is extremely powerful.

    A bit of a sidetrack but magnum needs an accuracy buff to even be considered amongst the deagle/glock meta.



  • Exactly how much was the Deagle accuracy increased? I didn’t notice much but it seems like people are suddenly saying it’s a sniper now. Does this have anything to do with the new way bullet inaccuracy is calculated?

    Actually when was the accuracy improvement implemented? I haven’t seen any complaints in the few hours I’ve been on in the last weeks.



  • @Humin said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:

    Exactly how much was the Deagle accuracy increased? I didn’t notice much but it seems like people are suddenly saying it’s a sniper now. Does this have anything to do with the new way bullet inaccuracy is calculated?

    Actually when was the accuracy improvement implemented? I haven’t seen any complaints in the few hours I’ve been on in the last weeks.

    From the old system it would have a minimum cone value of 2. Now it has 1.25. So nearly half the cone size that it had before.



  • The accuracy and rate of fire of the deagle are both rediculous and shoud be reduced, it was awful before the buff so I don’t think the accuracy should be reverted completely



  • @Dr.-Zoidcrab said in [ZS] Deagle Options for Nerfs/Adjustment:

    The accuracy and rate of fire of the deagle are both rediculous and shoud be reduced, it was awful before the buff so I don’t think the accuracy should be reverted completely

    It was kind of awful before the buff only in relative terms, because of the accuracy glitch the Glock ended up having. Effectively they’ve reversed roles. If it returned to the old values it wouldn’t be terrible but it might be too inaccurate. When considering a weapon more absolutely, it’s important to take out factors such as the other tier 2 weapons - don’t even consider they exist for this. We’re considering the Deagle the de facto tier 2, and as such, abstracting this to be the power level of tier 2 weapons. What has been poised, and what I agree with myself personally, is it extends the power of a tier 2 weapon too far.


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